Details of Agnes Grieve and Andrew Butler and their children William, Mary, Walter, John and Margaret, where known.

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Agnes Grieve married Andrew Butler on 9 November 1869 in Hawick, Roxburghshire. Anfrew was recorded as a Woollen Framework Knitter, aged 30, the son of William Butler, a Woollen Framework Knitter, and Mary Butler, maiden surname Hume, both identified as deceased. Agnes was recorded as a Woollen Factory Worker, aged 22, the daughter of Walter Grieve, a Wool Spinner, (deceased) and Mary Grieve, maiden surname Oliver. Andrew's place of residence was given as Roadhead, Wilton, and Agnes's as 11 Fore Row, Hawick, with the witnesses listed as Rachel Grieve, and Alexander Brydon. The birth and baptism of Andrew Butler were recorded on 15 April 1839, and 16 June 1839 respectively in Hawick, Roxburghshire. At the time of his marriage Andrew Butler had not long retired from the army having served with the 72nd Foot, (latterly the Seaforth Highlanders), and having seen action in India during the Indian Mutiny. (For further detail of the ancestry of Agnes Grieve and further chilren of Walter Grieve and Mary Oliver - click here.)

Agnes and Andrew had the following known children:

For the census of 1871 Agnes, Andrew and their infant daughter Mary were recorded resident at Roadhead, Wilton, Roxburghsirre, with Andrew identified as Woollen Framework Knitter.

1871 Census (3 April) Wilton (810) Book 4 Page 42

Roadhead, Wilton, Roxburghshire.

Name Relationship Age Occupation Where Born
Andrew Butler Head 31 Woollen Framework Knitter Wilton, Roxburghshire
Agnes Butler Wife 24   Hawick, Roxburghshire
William Butler Son 1   Wilton, Roxburghshire

For the census of 1881 Agnes, Andrew and their family had hoved to 2 Drumlanrig Place in Hawick, with now four children in the household. Their son Walter born in 1875 missing from this census had died in infancy.

1881 Census (4 April) Hawick (789) Book 14. Page 15.

2 Drumlanrig Place, (Back Of 50 Loan), Hawick, Roxburghshire.

Name Relationship Age Occupation Where Born
Andrew Butler Head 41 Woollen Framework Knitter Wilton, Roxburghshire
Agnes Butler Wife 33   Hawick, Roxburghshire
William Butler Son 11 Scholar Wilton, Roxburghshire
Mary Butler Daughter 9 Scholar Wilton, Roxburghshire
John Butler Son 4   Jedburgh, Roxburghshire
Maggie Butler Daughter 2   Hawick, Roxburghshire

For the census of 1891 Andrew, Agnes and their family were living next door to her widowed mother Mary at 21 Beaconsfield Terrace, Hawick. Andrew was listed as a "Foreman of Steam Frames" and their three younger children are included in the household, with Mary working as a "Binder off, Steam Frames". Their elder son William, who had just turned 21 is absent.

1891 Census (5 April) Hawick (789) Book 21 Page 22.

21 Beaconsfield Terrace, Hawick

Name Relationship Age Occupation Where Born
Mary Grieve Head 70 Living on Private Means Wilton, Roxburghshire
Andrew Butler Head 51 Foreman of Steam Frames Wilton, Roxburghshire
Agnes Butler Wife 42   Hawick, Roxburghshire
Mary Butler Daughter 19 Binder off, Steam Frames. Wilton, Roxburghshire
John Butler Son 14   Hawick, Roxburghshire
Maggie Butler Daughter 12   Hawick, Roxburghshire

For the census of 1901 Agnes and Andrew were still resident at 21 Beaconsfield Terrace, Hawick, again living next door to Agnes's widowed mother Mary, aged 82. Andrew is listed as Hosiery Foreman and only Maggie their younger daughter, is included in the household, listed as a dressmaker. The two eldest children, William and Mary, had married two years previously and John the younger son was still in South Africa with the Northumberland Volunteer Artillery fighting the Boers.

1901 Census (1 April) Hawick (789/1) Book 16 Page 24-25.

21 Beaconsfield Terrace, Hawick. (4 Rooms with 1 or more windows)

Name Relationship Age Occupation Where Born
Mary Grieve Head 82 Retired Hawick, Roxburghshire
Andrew Butler Head 61 Hosiery Foreman Hawick, Roxburghshire
Agnes Butler Wife 51   Hawick, Roxburghshire
Maggie Butler Daughter 21 Dressmaker Hawick, Roxburghshire

For the census of 1911 Agnes and Andrew were still in Hawick but had moved to 7 Minto Place. Andrew is listed as a Retired Woollen Hosiery Foreman and Maggie their younger daughter, is still included in the household, listed as a Dressmaker.

1911 Census (2 April) Hawick - 789 Book 8 Page 10

7 Minto Place, Hawick (3 Rooms with 1 or more windows)

Name

Relationship

Age      

Duration of

Marriage

No of

Children Born

No of Children

Surviving

Occupation

Where Born

Andrew Butler Head 71       Retired Woollen Hosiery Foreman Hawick, Roxburghshire
Agnes Butler Wife 62 41 6 4   Hawick, Roxburghshire
Margaret Butler Daughter 31       Dressmaker Hawick, Roxburghshire

I believe Agnes died, aged 66, on 5 October 1914 in Hawick, Roxburghshire, with her death recorded in the Scottish BMD Index for that year in Hawick, Roxburghshire. Andrew died, aged 77, on 26 October 1916, with his death recorded in the Scottish BMD Index for that year also in Hawick, Roxburghshire. The Hawick News and Border Chronicle of the day follwing Andrew's demise contained a brief article. This has been transcribed by OCR hence the uncertainty over a few words \ phrases)

Hawick News and Border Chronicle - Friday 27 October 1916
Death of an Indian Mutiny Veteran. The death look yesterday afternoon of Andrew Butler, 7 Minto Place, a well known and much respected townsman. Born in the Roadhead, years ago. Butler joined the Dumfries Militia ?1857?, and was drafted to the battalion of the Duke of Albany's Own Highlanders, now the Seaforth Highlanders. He volunteered for service in India in 1858, and reached Bombay on the ?11th? May of that year and marched up country to ?Lucknow? where joined the Central Indian Field Force under Colonel ?Campbell?. After eight years in India, he returned to this country, and completed his army service Aldershot, receiving his discharge in January 1868, after ten years service. In April 1911, at a meeting in the Drill Hall, Butler was presented with an Indian Mutiny medal, the presentation being made by the late Earl of Minto, so Uiat waited years receiving it. For the long period of 39 years, Butler was the employment of Messrs John Laings, hosiery manufacturers, Slitrig Crescent, retiring some years ago, and of late he had been in indifferent health. He was a respected elder in the West Port Free Church and for many years a devoted teacher in the Sunday School. A widower, the deceased is survived by two sons and two daughters, one of his sons being on active service with the K.O.S.B.

This an image of Andrew's actual medal which was sold at auction at Easters Court, Leominster, Herefordshireon on 26 February 2014 by Brightwells, Sporting and Militaria. United Kingdom catalogued as INDIAN MUTINY 1857-58, no clasp, (No. 175 Private Andrew Butler 72nd Foot). Why he had to wait until 1911 for his medal is unknown but may relate to the fact that the medal was initially sanctioned for award to those troops who had been engaged in action against the mutineers, but was extended in 1868 to all those who had borne arms or who had been under fire. As Andrew had left the regiment in the January of that year, it is possible he was unaware of his entitlement until later. (NOTE: The DNW auction site lists the award of the Indian Mutiny medal to Andrew Butler as issued 23 March 1911.)

Indian Mutiny Medal - Andrew Butler

An image of Andrew Butler's actual medal
sold at auction at Easters Court,
Leominster, Herefordshire on
26 February 2014 by Brightwells
Sporting and Militaria.

Further Details of Andrew and Ages's children - where known.

William Butler born on 23 March 1870 in Wilton, Roxburghshire.

I believe William, married in 1899 as there is a record of the marriage of a William Butler and a Janet Birrell Shepherd in the Scottish BMD index for that year registered in St Andrew, Edinburgh. I believe Janet was born on 11 February 1872 in Selkirk, Selkirkshire, the daughter of James Birrell Shepherd and Ann Nichol Watson. William and Janet had the following children:

  • Annie Watson Butler born in 1900 in Hawick, Roxburghshire.
  • Andrew Butler born in 1901 in Hawick, Roxburghshire.
  • Agnes Grieve Butler born in 1903 in Hawick, Roxburghshire.
  • Margaret Butler born in 1908 in Galashiels, Selkirkshire.
  • Janet Birrell Butler born in 1909 in Galashiels, Selkirkshire, and died in 1994 in Prestonpans, East Lothian.
  • Possible 6th child based on the fact that the 1911 census records they had six children, all who were surviving at the time, but only five are listed in the household??
  • For the census of 1901 William, Janet and their 10 month old daughter Annie were recorded at 4 Green Terrace Hawick, with William working as a Tailor. The house was recorded as having 2 rooms with 1 or more windows.

    1901 Census (1 April) Hawick 789/1 Book 15 Page 22

    4 Green Terrace Hawick

    Name Relationship Age Occupation Where Born
    William Butler Head 30 Tailor Hawick, Roxburghshire
    Janet Butler Wife 29   Selkirk, Selkirkshire
    Annie Butler Daughter 10 Months   Hawick, Roxburghshire

    For the 1911 census William and Janet were living at 26 King Street, Galashiels with their family of 5 children and William working as a tailor at home of his own accord. The house was recorded as having 4 rooms with one or more windows. The couple were also recorded as having had 6 children with all having survived.

    1911 Census (2 April) Galashiels (775) Book 15 Page 10

    25 King Street, Galashiels, Selkirkshire

    Name

    Relationship

    Age      

    Duration of

    Marriage

    No of

    Children Born

    No of Children

    Surviving

    Occupation

    Where Born

    William Butler Head 41       Tailor Hawick, Roxburghshire
    Janet Butler Wife 39 11; 6 6   Selkirk, Selkirkshire
    Annie Butler Daughter 10       School Hawick, Roxburghshire
    Andrew Butler Son 9       School Hawick, Roxburghshire
    Aggie Butler Daughter 7       School Hawick, Roxburghshire
    Maggie Butler Daughter 2         Galashiels, Selkirkshire.
    Janet Butler DaughterSon 1         Galashiels, Selkirkshire.

    William died aged 52 on 10 May 1922 in 4 Wilton Crescent Lane, Hawick, Roxburghshire. He was recorded as a Tailor, married to Janet Shepherd, the son of Andrew Butler, a Wool Framework Knitter, and Agnes Butler, maiden surname Grieve, both listed as deceased. The informant was Andrew Butler, son. I believe Janet died in 1954 as there is a record of the death of a Janet Birrell Butler or Shepherd, aged 82, in the Scottish BMD index for that year registered in in Hawick, Roxburghshire.

    Mary Butler born on 31 January 1872 in Wilton, Roxburghshire.

    I believe Mary married in 1899 as there is a record of the marriage of a Mary Butler and an Andrew Turnbull in the Scottish BMD index for that year registered in Hawick, Roxburghshire. Andrew was born about 1873. Margaret and Andrew had the following children:

    For the census of 1901 Andrew and Mary were recorded along with their young daughter Agnes in Broughton Road, Fulham, London, Middlesex, with Andrew working as a Farrier. The baby Agnes was recorded as aged 1 and born in Fulham, which would suggest the couple had moved south not long after their marriage.

    1901 Census (1 April) Fulham Middlesex Schedule 399 Page 62

    Broughton Road, Fulham, London, Middlesex

    Name Relationship Age Occupation Where Born
    Andrew Turnbull Head 28 Farrier Selkirk, Scotland
    Mary Turnbull Wife 29   Hawick, Roxburghshire
    Agnes G. Turnbull Daughter 1   Fulham, London

    For the census of 1911 Mary, Andrew and their 4 children were living in Hawick ar 1 Orrock Place, Hawick, with the house recorded as having 2 rooms with one or more windows. Andrew was recorded as a Blacksmith working for himself., and the couple were recorded as having been married for 11 years and having had 5 children one of whom had died. I believe the child who had died prior to this census was Maggie Butler Turnbull whose her birth was registered in the January-March quarter of 1904, in Fulham, London, and whose death was registered in the April-June quarter of 1905, in Fulham, London.

    1911 Census (2 April) Hawick (789) Book 17 Page 4

    1 Orrock Place, Hawick, Roxburghshire

    Name

    Relationship

    Age      

    Duration of

    Marriage

    No of

    Children Born

    No of Children

    Surviving

    Occupation

    Where Born

    Andrew Turnbull Head 38       Blacksmith Selkirk, Selkirkshire
    Mary Turnbull Wife 39 11 5 4   Hawick, Roxburghshire
    Agnes Turnbull Daughter 11       School England
    Jean Turnbull DaughterSon 9       School England
    Walter Turnbull Son 5       School England
    Andrew Turnbull Son 2         Hawick, Roxburghshire.

    Mary died, aged 64, on 30 July 1936 in Royal Infirmary, Edinburgh, although her usual residence was listed as 28 Main Road, Bo'Ness and Carriden, West Lothian. She was recorded as married to Andrew Turnbull, a Blacksmith, and as the daughter of Andrew Butler, a Hosiery Factory Foreman, and Agnes Butler, maiden surname Grieve, both who were listed as deceased. The informant was Andrew Turnbull, widower, of 28 Main Road, Bo'Ness and Carriden. I believe Andrew died in 1950 as there is a record of the death of an Andrew Butler, , aged 78,, in the Scottish BMD index for that year registered in Bo'Ness and Carriden, West Lothian.

    Walter Grieve Butler born on 29 April 1874 in Hawick, Roxburghshire.

    I believe Walter died in infancy in 1875 as there is a record of the death of an Walter Grieve Butler, aged 2, in the Scottish BMD index for that yearregistered in Hawick, Roxburghshire.

    John Butler born 15 July 1876 in Hawick, Roxburghshire.

    With his parents for the 1881 and 1891 censuses I believe John may have gone tp work at the Elswick Ordnance Company in Newcastle sometime prior to 1898. This is based on the fact that he was a member of the Elswick Battery, manned by the 1st Northumberland Volunteer Artillery which went to South Africa during the Boer War. According to a source on the internet this force was composed entirely of men from the Elswick works, hence the likelihood that John was working there at this time. (For further detail the Elswick Battery and their service in the Boer war - click here.)

    John along with the other 243 Officers and men sailed for South Africa, most likely the only gunners to be armed with field pieces which they themselves had made. It would seem the Battery played a positive part throughout the war, sailing for home on 28th June 1901.

    For the 1911 census there is a John Butler, aged 33, an unmarried Railway Labourer, born in Hawick, Roxburghshire, boarding in the household of Thomas and Charlotte Willoughby in Sheffield, Yorkshire, which may well be John.

    However the next definate record we have of John is his enlistment in the Kings Own Scottish Borders on 21 August 1914, 17 days after Britain had declared war on Germany. His attestment papers give residence at the time as hawick, Roxburghshire, and confirm that he had served with the 1st Northumberland Volunteers but hat his time with them had expired. His next of kin was listed as as Andrew Butler, 7 Minto Place, Hawick his father, and he was decribed as 5' 3 7/8" tall, weighing 114 pounds, with a 33 3/4" inch chest with an expansion range of 1 3/4". His eyes were Hazel and he had brown hair. His current occupation was given as clerk, and his age as 37 years and 28 days.

    John survived the war but was wounded twice. An outline of John's service with the K.O.S.B. in World War 1 from his service record.....

    The local newspaper, Hawick News and Border Chronicle, carried a brief report on Friday 1 October 1915 on the occasion of John's being wounded in 1915. (This and the following article have been transcribed by OCR hence the uncertainty over a few words \ phrases)

    Hawick News and Border Chronicle - Friday 01 October 1915
    Private John Bntier, 8th K.O.S.B. has sent a field postcard to his father dated 27th Sept. informing him that is wounded and has been admitted to hospital. Private Butler served through the Boer War, being in the Elswick Battery. His father, Mr Andrew Butler, 7 Minto Place is an Indian Mutiny veteran.

    The following year on Friday 12 May 1916 the same newspaper carried a further article about John with a brief description of his life in the trenches. The letter must have come as a huge relief to his family as the article states that he had been reported missing in a letter from the wife of the Colonel of the regiment the previous week! It Ironically only six weeks or so after this letter John was wounded in action yet again, probably during the Somme ofensive.

    Hawick News and Border Chronicle - Friday 12 May 1916
    Hawick Soldier’s Lively Experiences. Writing his father, Mr A. Butler, 7 Minto Place, under Saturday’s date, Private John Butler, K.O.S.B., says- “I am enjoying good health. have just come out the trenches after nine days. has been awful. The Germans bombarded us every day. I never expected to get out alive. They were sending all sorts of shells across. We did not know where to place ourselves for safety, they were sending in all the dug-outs. got in one, but was not hurt, for which I nave to thank God. We go back into the trenches in a week’s time; I hope it won’t be so rough again. Private Butler had been reported missing, a letter to this effect having been received last week from the wife of the Colonel of the Regiment. That this was mistake is shown by the letter of later date from which the above extracts are given. Private Butler served through the South African War as a member of the Elswick Battery. His father is veteran soldier of Indian Mutiny fame.

    John survived the war and was awarded the 1914-1915 Star, the British War Medal and British Victory Medal for his service. It would seem being back in Hawick for 1919, and there is a reference in the Hawick News and Border Chronicle for Friday 20 November 1931 of a Private John Butler placing a wreath on a memorial presumably for Armistice day, but whether this was this John Butler and whether he was resident in Hawick is unknown.

    What became of John is unkown and no obvious record of his death in Scotland has been found. It seems possible that he died elsewhere in the UK or possible overseas. (In the notes against his grandparent's grave compliled by the Hawick Archeology Society he is listed as of Newcastle upon Tyne.) It would seem likely that he never married but I would be interested in discovering what became of John. Should you be able to provide and further details please get in touch via the contact form using the link at the top of this page.

    Margaret Butler born 18 December 1878 in Hawick, Roxburghshire.

    Still recorded with her parents for the 1911 census, Margaret married Richard Lawson Dingwall Young, a Mechanical Engineer, on 24 March 1917 in Prestonpans, East Lothian. An announcement of the marriage was carried by the Hawick News and Border Chronicle on 30 March 1917 - "Young—Butler,— At U.F. Manse, Prestonpans, on 24th inst.. by Rev. A.W. Weitwater, M.A., Richard L. D. Young; Bo'Ness, to Maggie, daughter of the late Adam Butler. 7 Minto Place, Hawick". There is also a record of the marriage of a Maggie Butler and an Richard L. D. Young in the Scottish BMD index for that year registered in Prestonpans. I believe Richard was born in 1886 in Bo'Ness and Carriden, West Lothian.

    Margaret died, aged 82, on 21 December 1960 in 21a Dean Road, Bo'Ness and Carriden, West Lothian. She was recorded as married to Richard Lawson Dingwall Young, a Retired Mechanical Engineer, and as the daughter of Andrew Butler, a Hosiery Foreman, and Agnes Butler, maiden surname Grieve, both of whom were listed as deceased. The informant was ?J. S.? Young, son, of 6 Grosvenor Cottages, Eaton Terrace, London.

    I believe Richard died in 1967 as there is a record of the death of an Richard Lawson Young, aged 81, in the Scottish BMD index registered for that year in Bo'Ness and Carriden, West Lothian. It seems likely there were no children born to Margaret and Richard.